Game 30 - A10 Tournament: #9 GMU (14-15 / 7-9) vs #8 Fordham (15-15 / 8-10) on Thursday, March 10, at NOON.

[Patriot Lawdog]

Yeah I mean I agree talk is cheap, but the season is over, what would you be looking for following an L today? I’ll take this cheap talk over the alternative, which is also still cheap talk. At least we are recognizing publicly that there are issues, something something step one…

Yea, there's also no guarantee that a lot of this wasn't being preached or discussed throughout the second half of the season. Can't bench everyone and you don't want to bury your team in the media....Looking back, this tends to happen to a team that has noone who can create and get to the rim and relies on jump shooting. From a coaching standpoint, too much being designed around subpar PGs is not a recipe for success.

 

[gmutom]

One thing English spoke about after today's game is getting guys to play with more emotion, toughness and swagger, and I have been struggling to think about who on this team fits that bill. Schwartz, Cooper and Gaines are all good players, but they rarely show any emotion. Josh is definitely understated with a few exceptions, and I don't recall XJ, Polite, Hartwell or even Jones getting fired up.

The only guys who come to mind are Henry and Frazier, and who knows if either one will be on the team next year. Maybe I'm misinterpreting the intangibles he is talking about, but if I'm not he has a lot to do to change the culture or bring in guys who check those boxes.

 

[Earl the Squirrel]

He’s taking the blame and that’s fine, but the reality is there’s only so much a coach can do about his team constantly choking — other than get a bunch of new players, which I’m sure is Plan A. There must be leadership, toughness and will to win on the floor, it can’t all come from the coach.

I'm all in on KE. I expect he'll overhaul the team and put us in a position to be successful next year. He's demonstrated he can recruit. Complete confidence in him on this front. And recruiting is 90% of the battle.

Having said that, there's no denying the team imploded down the stretch. And it had to weigh (fairly or unfairly) on English. Coming into the season he was heralded as a rising star (and featured in Sports Illustrated). We win 4 straight to open the season and beat MD for the first time. I thought the guy walked on water. And there was the speculation he might even be offered the MD head gig! Crazy times.

This ending has to be a gut punch (it should be!). The bloom is off the rose and now he's just another young coach - just like Kyle Neptune. It's got to be hard for KE to process and come to terms with.

A couple of head-scratchers for me, as I reflect on this first year:

1. KE says the team has a lot of nice guys but isn't "tough" enough. This perplexes me. The heart of the "team" features guys KE either convinced to stay, or brought in. He wants toughness but settled for softies?
- If he is referring to the scrap heap on the bench he inherited from Paulsen, I call BS. They barely played. You can't say they are the problem.
2. His dismissal of vcu's defense as a gimmick (per GS or Gemini -- I stand corrected if he did not say this). Huh??? Definitely not a gimmick. A very silly characterization, if true. They got a double bye. We got sent packing after day 1.
4. He seems inflexible. I get our identity as a 3 pt shooting team, but I want to see some willingness to adapt.
5. Very inconsistent rotations. Normally, you use the early part of the season to try out different combinations and settle on a rotation. Kim never settled.
6. Does he really like Polite's game (per his comments in the post game presser), or is he just paying lip service? I'm sure he's not thrilled with either XJ or Polite, but Polite, at least according to my eyes, is in no way better than XJ. KE called Ronnie's number twice with the game on the line. I'm just a couch potato, with no access to practices, but would NEVER, EVER, hand the keys to Polite with the season on the brink. I don't care who you think is "tougher" the numbers don't lie. Polite is no XJ.

And, yeah, we had some horrible calls go against us during this game, but I place this loss squarely on KE and staff. It wasn't the players' lack of toughness. Josh did not take a shot over the last 15 mins of the game. Look it up!

Hope KE reflects on what worked and what didn't and is willing to adapt going forward.

Just slowly accepting we are out of the A10 tourney. My wife says, "Wait til next year."

She doesn't get it. November is a long way off.

 

[JimP]

I'm all in on KE. I expect he'll overhaul the team and put us in a position to be successful next year. He's demonstrated he can recruit. Complete confidence in him on this front. And recruiting is 90% of the battle.

Having said that, there's no denying the team imploded down the stretch. And it had to weigh (fairly or unfairly) on English. Coming into the season he was heralded as a rising star (and featured in Sports Illustrated). We win 4 straight to open the season and beat MD for the first time. I thought the guy walked on water. And there was the speculation he might even be offered the MD head gig! Crazy times.

This ending has to be a gut punch (it should be!). The bloom is off the rose and now he's just another young coach - just like Kyle Neptune. It's got to be hard for KE to process and come to terms with.

A couple of head-scratchers for me, as I reflect on this first year:

1. KE says the team has a lot of nice guys but isn't "tough" enough. This perplexes me. The heart of the "team" features guys KE either convinced to stay, or brought in. He wants toughness but settled for softies?
- If he is referring to the scrap heap on the bench he inherited from Paulsen, I call BS. They barely played. You can't say they are the problem.
2. His dismissal of vcu's defense as a gimmick (per GS or Gemini -- I stand corrected if he did not say this). Huh??? Definitely not a gimmick. A very silly characterization, if true. They got a double bye. We got sent packing after day 1.
4. He seems inflexible. I get our identity as a 3 pt shooting team, but I want to see some willingness to adapt.
5. Very inconsistent rotations. Normally, you use the early part of the season to try out different combinations and settle on a rotation. Kim never settled.
6. Does he really like Polite's game (per his comments in the post game presser), or is he just paying lip service? I'm sure he's not thrilled with either XJ or Polite, but Polite, at least according to my eyes, is in no way better than XJ. KE called Ronnie's number twice with the game on the line. I'm just a couch potato, with no access to practices, but would NEVER, EVER, hand the keys to Polite with the season on the brink. I don't care who you think is "tougher" the numbers don't lie. Polite is no XJ.

And, yeah, we had some horrible calls go against us during this game, but I place this loss squarely on KE and staff. It wasn't the players' lack of toughness. Josh did not take a shot over the last 15 mins of the game. Look it up!

Hope KE reflects on what worked and what didn't and is willing to adapt going forward.

Just slowly accepting we are out of the A10 tourney. My wife says, "Wait til next year."

She doesn't get it. November is a long way off.

Yep, it's definitely nof a simple matter of more toughmess and a limited roster. Sure, that's part of it. When things like Polite getting more shots than Oduro are occurring, it's concerning. Even if KE does a great job building a roster for next season, the coaching needs to improve for KE to take the team where he wants to take it. I disagree with the sentiment that "you guys are worried over nothing" that I seem to pick up in some posts.

 

[GMU_Polevaulter]

The first 5 games of conference play showed how good this team could play and the stretch of the final 12 games was hard to watch but I much preferred watching this team then DP's teams and not once did KE say we practiced like an NBA team but they didn't show today!

Fewer foot dribbles, fewer throws to the invisible player. This team was in most games and yes failed to close them out. Like KE said we are what the record says we are 14-16.
Tough year no doubt, bad lose to Fordham. Kudos to Fordham and the other A-10 teams that realized you could beat GMU by not guarding some players and packing it in around others. Our bench play was towards the bottom of all the NCAA men's teams and to me that and the PG play was the story this year.
I saw improvements this year and I have no doubt things will be better next year. Let's see how the roster shakes out over the next few weeks......

 

[sleeperpick]

Yep, it's definitely nof a simple matter of more toughmess and a limited roster. Sure, that's part of it. When things like Polite getting more shots than Oduro are occurring, it's concerning. Even if KE does a great job building a roster for next season, the coaching needs to improve for KE to take the team where he wants to take it. I disagree with the sentiment that "you guys are worried over nothing" that I seem to pick up in some posts.

Not to call you out specifically… but some of the folks “worried” after a year where CKE had a very short amount of time to adjust a D2 roster he was left with (and didn’t kick players out) were just fine and excited about DP year 2-4. That makes no sense to me. If you’re going to watch paint dry basketball and be content for 2-4 years of some of the worst basketball known to man I don’t see why the panic button is pressed 10 months after CKE got the job. We have the second highest recruiting class in Mason history coming In along with Oduro who has a ton to prove and Gaines who is learning how to become a beast. That’s more exciting to me than anything the program has had since L. Not be any more ageist than I currently am around this nursing home but people forget way too much about the dynamics of the current college basketball landscape. The transfer market is where CKE will make his moves and it’s not open yet. Just wait and see like 99% of you did when DP was getting the Hartwells and Kam Murrels of the world that you so proudly rooted on.

Also I was ridiculed for saying Coach Felton was a horrible hire… I still think he is. CKE should have gotten an x and o guy not a 4th recruiter to be his top assistant. Coach Felton is and alWays has been considered a bleh coach.

 

[gmubrian]

Not to call you out specifically… but some of the folks “worried” after a year where CKE had a very short amount of time to adjust a D2 roster he was left with (and didn’t kick players out) were just fine and excited about DP year 2-4. That makes no sense to me. If you’re going to watch paint dry basketball and be content for 2-4 years of some of the worst basketball known to man I don’t see why the panic button is pressed 10 months after CKE got the job. We have the second highest recruiting class in Mason history coming In along with Oduro who has a ton to prove and Gaines who is learning how to become a beast. That’s more exciting to me than anything the program has had since L. Not be any more ageist than I currently am around this nursing home but people forget way too much about the dynamics of the current college basketball landscape. The transfer market is where CKE will make his moves and it’s not open yet. Just wait and see like 99% of you did when DP was getting the Hartwells and Kam Murrels of the world that you so proudly rooted on.

Also I was ridiculed for saying Coach Felton was a horrible hire… I still think he is. CKE should have gotten an x and o guy not a 4th recruiter to be his top assistant. Coach Felton is and alWays has been considered a bleh coach.

I like that you almost went a whole post without publicly insulting someone personally, and at least it is one of the grown ups. Additionally, I applaud the overall sentiment of your post that it is a little early to be hitting the panic button. There is a lot to point to at the moment to look forward to about our future. The next year or two should really show us what trajectory CKE has us on.

 

[Dawgs99]

Not to call you out specifically… but some of the folks “worried” after a year where CKE had a very short amount of time to adjust a D2 roster he was left with (and didn’t kick players out) were just fine and excited about DP year 2-4. That makes no sense to me. If you’re going to watch paint dry basketball and be content for 2-4 years of some of the worst basketball known to man I don’t see why the panic button is pressed 10 months after CKE got the job. We have the second highest recruiting class in Mason history coming In along with Oduro who has a ton to prove and Gaines who is learning how to become a beast. That’s more exciting to me than anything the program has had since L. Not be any more ageist than I currently am around this nursing home but people forget way too much about the dynamics of the current college basketball landscape. The transfer market is where CKE will make his moves and it’s not open yet. Just wait and see like 99% of you did when DP was getting the Hartwells and Kam Murrels of the world that you so proudly rooted on.

Also I was ridiculed for saying Coach Felton was a horrible hire… I still think he is. CKE should have gotten an x and o guy not a 4th recruiter to be his top assistant. Coach Felton is and alWays has been considered a bleh coach.

Like Brian, I agree with the overall sentiment of this post. However, your obsession with DP and how some posters (myself included) supported and rooted for him and his players to succeed is borderline creepy. 99% of the posters on here realized that he wasn't the answer pretty early on but we didn't see the need to throw him under the bus in every post. Fact of the matter is we have a coach now in CKE that will always have a more competitive roster than at any point under DP, that in itself is a win. Iron out some of the first year learning curve items and I still love the trajectory the program is on.

 

[gmubrian]

...
A couple of head-scratchers for me, as I reflect on this first year:

1. KE says the team has a lot of nice guys but isn't "tough" enough. This perplexes me. The heart of the "team" features guys KE either convinced to stay, or brought in. He wants toughness but settled for softies?
- If he is referring to the scrap heap on the bench he inherited from Paulsen, I call BS. They barely played. You can't say they are the problem.
2. His dismissal of vcu's defense as a gimmick (per GS or Gemini -- I stand corrected if he did not say this). Huh??? Definitely not a gimmick. A very silly characterization, if true. They got a double bye. We got sent packing after day 1.
4. He seems inflexible. I get our identity as a 3 pt shooting team, but I want to see some willingness to adapt.
5. Very inconsistent rotations. Normally, you use the early part of the season to try out different combinations and settle on a rotation. Kim never settled.
6. Does he really like Polite's game (per his comments in the post game presser), or is he just paying lip service? I'm sure he's not thrilled with either XJ or Polite, but Polite, at least according to my eyes, is in no way better than XJ. KE called Ronnie's number twice with the game on the line. I'm just a couch potato, with no access to practices, but would NEVER, EVER, hand the keys to Polite with the season on the brink. I don't care who you think is "tougher" the numbers don't lie. Polite is no XJ.

I respond to your points below:
1. As others have pointed out, he had like 6 weeks from being a first time head coach to assembling a team for this year. Also he may not have realized at the time that we didn't have a tough group.

2. Maybe CKE said something about gimmick defense, but I can't find it. A search of posts shows that the phrase phrase "gimmick defense" in reference to vcu has been used on here long before English came along. Maybe some transference is going on.

4. I don't see 3 point shooting as our identity and I don't see CKE as inflexible. He likes the 3, but he has also said he likes 2 point layups even more. He studies the game and the stats and that is where the payoff is. He has just given the team the green light to shoot threes IF THEY ARE OPEN. I don't have an issue with that. Now, do you need to use mid range jumpers to keep the defense honest, maybe.

5. On the rotations, I think he had his rotation pretty set until it wasn't performing to his standards. There may be a little bit of revision of history going on here to say he didn't. His rotation was still pretty small and he still relied primarily on his starting 5 from the late non-conference schedule, but he needed people to spell the starters and he got Polite back from injury mid-season which would explain his mid-season insertion into the rotation.

6. I think you answered this point, somewhat, yourself. He isn't happy with the PG position. Also, I don't think he called Polite's number twice. I think he MAY have called it once, and the second time it appears that Polite called his own number.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

Talk is cheap. We got worse in practically every area throughout the season. That's what I'm pissed off about. Not wins and losses.

It is great that he can recruit, but KE needs to take a big sophomore leap as a coach.

Yup, thats what is concerning. Teams clearly were able to adjust to us more than we could them.

A relatively healthy year where we got worse and our development was < everybody else's.

Still, Im not too concerned. KE should improve, and transfer portal notwithstanding, its always years 3-4 that really matter. Has time to develop talent.

I do think the main shame of this year was "striking while the iron is hot." KE's iron was/is hot, will it stay that way?

 

[Patriot Lawdog]

I guess what really gives me confidence is CKE seems like the type of guy who is open to doing a deep dive on everything including himself and learning from any mistakes that were made. He doesn't give off the vibe of being inflexible. I fully admit that I signed up for this and was on board with the hire so it's time to see it through.

 

[gmujim92]

Yup, thats what is concerning. Teams clearly were able to adjust to us more than we could them.

A relatively healthy year where we got worse and our development was < everybody else's.

Still, Im not too concerned. KE should improve, and transfer portal notwithstanding, its always years 3-4 that really matter. Has time to develop talent.

I do think the main shame of this year was "striking while the iron is hot." KE's iron was/is hot, will it stay that way?

The results of this season will do absolutely nothing to reduce KE’s stature within the basketball community. People know he’s smart and driven and prepares like a madman, and that he genuinely cares about his players on and off the floor.

If anything, the fact that he couldn’t squeeze a winning record out of this group will be widely seen as even more of an indictment on the Mason program. Already starting to see chatter on social that if Kim can’t win here, then the L years truly were the craziest of outliers.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

The results of this season will do absolutely nothing to reduce KE’s stature within the basketball community. People know he’s smart and driven and prepares like a madman, and that he genuinely cares about his players on and off the floor.

If anything, the fact that he couldn’t squeeze a winning record out of this group will be widely seen as even more of an indictment on the Mason program. Already starting to see chatter on social that if Kim can’t win here, then the L years truly were the craziest of outliers.

LOL, come on. Forwarding this second paragraph to Joe Biden's team.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

If anything, the fact that he couldn’t squeeze a winning record out of this group will be widely seen as even more of an indictment on the Mason program. Already starting to see chatter on social that if Kim can’t win here, then the L years truly were the craziest of outliers.

Dude, just come on. Just, come on.

What are we running with this time, facilities? We. Had. A. Wining. Record. In the A10. Just last year.

Honestly, if you're going to start with this the guy is 100% infallible, let me off. There is a very real chance that his coaching job this year was at best, below industry average.

Now that might improve, and I think it will, but don't sit here and say "if KE couldn't squeeze a winning record with this group" when three of the starters were his guys, and as if he's some already accomplished master tactician...

Just come on. Can there ever be grey on these boards and not black or white??

 

[gmujim92]

LOL, come on. Forwarding this second paragraph to Joe Biden's team.

We’re on Coach No. 3 post-Larranaga, Chris.

After a while, the whole “it’s the coach” bit starts to sound like a bunch of BS.

 

[mkaufman1]

Yup, thats what is concerning. Teams clearly were able to adjust to us more than we could them.

A relatively healthy year where we got worse and our development was < everybody else's.

Still, Im not too concerned. KE should improve, and transfer portal notwithstanding, its always years 3-4 that really matter. Has time to develop talent.

I do think the main shame of this year was "striking while the iron is hot." KE's iron was/is hot, will it stay that way?

Totally agree with this post. How teams adjusted to mason and vice versa is something I’ve very curious about. We went from Cooper Gaines and Schwartz creating and making threes to those guys not getting good looks and Oduro getting double teamed a lot.

I’d love to know what happened especially late in the year that changed this course.

The key to me is like what you said regarding years 3-4, but I do expect next year to be much improved.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

We’re on Coach No. 3 post-Larranaga, Chris.

After a while, the whole “it’s the coach” bit starts to sound like a bunch of BS.

So, in what way is Kim English "not squeezing a winning record" out with this group (which was done the previous year) an indictment on Mason in any way?

There is literally zero logical sense in that. Zero.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

Totally agree with this post. How teams adjusted to mason and vice versa is something I’ve very curious about. We went from Cooper Gaines and Schwartz creating and making threes to those guys not getting good looks and Oduro getting double teamed a lot.

I’d love to know what happened especially late in the year that changed this course.

The key to me is like what you said regarding years 3-4, but I do expect next year to be much improved.

I would defer to people who saw more Mason than me this year but clearly teams started to sag off XJ and Polite to defend other guys closer. Not just Oduro either.

Like I said, I think we're still fine, and I think we're on the right path. But Kim English is not there yet, any more than the roster is/needs to be.

 

[gmujim92]

So, in what way is Kim English "not squeezing a winning record" out with this group (which was done the previous year) an indictment on Mason in any way?

There is literally zero logical sense in that. Zero.

I said that will be the perception within the basketball community. Argue it if you wish, but you’ll be wrong.

 

[Walter]

I said that will be the perception within the basketball community. Argue it if you wish, but you’ll be wrong.

By “basketball community” do you mean fan message boards or the voices in your head?