OT: President Cabrera Will Serve on the FRB of Richmond

[Falco]

Most of the schools on that list I wouldn't consider to be highly successful programs.

Also since the last expansion, there has been a moratorium placed on anyone else moving up. The BCS schools also voted themselves more autonomy from the NCAA while making it harder for non-BCS schools to break into the newly created BCS playoffs. It is not a good time to be a non-BCS football member of the NCAA. Even if the BCS expands again, it's going to be taking schools like UConn, Cincinatti, and Memphis. And I don't really see anyone expanding outside of the Big 12, which just voted NOT to expand (Big 10 is at 14, the ACC is at 14, the SEC is at 14; outisde of the BCS CUSA is at 13, MAC is at 12, AAC is at 12 -- these are pregnant conferences already).

Let us not forget that the Virginia legislature also made it more difficult for schools to support programs with student fees, so doubling students fees a la ODU to start a football program isn't going to work at Mason.

UGA is also in Athens, Georgia, which is 72 miles away from Atlanta and also has almost 120 years of history.

I'm not really sure why we can't just be happy building a premier basketball program like so many schools in the Big East and A-10 (and yes I know some of them play non-scholarship or limited scholarship football, but that's neither here nor there). We should be looking to schools like Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, Dayton, Butler, Creighton, Xavier, vcu and Davidson instead of trying to figure out how UCLA and Pitt and Miami can field both football and basketball in pro-sports towns.

edit: I also forgot to mention that starting an FCS level program at this point might be hard, too, considering there's no way the CAA will allow us to join ever, and the SoCon won't let us join as a football affiliate. That leaves you with maybe the Pioneer or Northeast Conferences, neither of which are ideal fits.

Again everyone points to reasons it's difficult to start a program. No one is saying starting a program would be easy. But neither was flying to the moon. It all depends on if people want it or not. If there is a will there is a way.

 

[GMUgemini]

Again everyone points to reasons it's difficult to start a program. No one is saying starting a program would be easy. But neither was flying to the moon. It all depends on if people want it or not. If there is a will there is a way.

Well, to that I would say if the AD's plan was to start football with an eventual eye to moving up to FBS, we would have stayed in the CAA and started a football program to fill in the void ODU left.

But we joined the A-10 and are focused on our basketball program instead, which to me, if we do this right, is a much better and more sustainable plan.

Maybe someday, when the balance sheet looks better, we can throw the football heads a bone and join conference mates Dayton and Davidson in the Pioneer League, but I wouldn't expect much out of the football team.

 

[Falco]

Well, to that I would say if the AD's plan was to start football with an eventual eye to moving up to FBS, we would have stayed in the CAA and started a football program to fill in the void ODU left.

But we joined the A-10 and are focused on our basketball program instead, which to me, if we do this right, is a much better and more sustainable plan.

Maybe someday, when the balance sheet looks better, we can throw the football heads a bone and join conference mates Dayton and Davidson in the Pioneer League, but I wouldn't expect much out of the football team.

That's fair. I just wish more people would say they don't want football instead of listing reasons why we can't have football.

If more people said they didn't want it the conversation would be over. Hard to debate people just don't want it. Haha

 

[GMUgemini]

The problem is people who want football will never accept the fact that football isn't in the plans at Mason. A conversation like this happens on the boards every single year.

The other problem is, almost all of us here would gladly take a football team so long as it means it won't hurt the basketball team's position (me included). So, it's not like I would lobby against a credible plan put forward by the AD.

I mean, my dad is a Penn State alum and I grew up in Miami, so you can guess what we used to watch on Saturdays growing up -- all day. We used to go to the Orange Bowl Parade every year (until they stopped having them -- I was at the last one ever, too, and was gladly booing the Florida Gator players as they marched down Biscayne Blvd.). Since coming to Mason, though, I've grown to love the college basketball game so much more and how the landscape is so much more open to "outsiders" or "underdogs" or "Cinderellas" than the football landscape. I love the semi-even playing field March Madness provides to the smaller programs.

Now that we are in the A-10, I wish our alumni and student body would do a fullthroated support and embrace of collegiate basketball culture and just be a basketball school. That's my opinion. Forget football.

 

[Falco]

The problem is people who want football will never accept the fact that football isn't in the plans at Mason. A conversation like this happens on the boards every single year.

The other problem is, almost all of us here would gladly take a football team so long as it means it won't hurt the basketball team's position (me included). So, it's not like I would lobby against a credible plan put forward by the AD.

I mean, my dad is a Penn State alum and I grew up in Miami, so you can guess what we used to watch on Saturdays growing up -- all day. We used to go to the Orange Bowl Parade every year (until they stopped having them -- I was at the last one ever, too, and was gladly booing the Florida Gator players as they marched down Biscayne Blvd.). Since coming to Mason, though, I've grown to love the college basketball game so much more and how the landscape is so much more open to "outsiders" or "underdogs" or "Cinderellas" than the football landscape. I love the semi-even playing field March Madness provides to the smaller programs.

Now that we are in the A-10, I wish our alumni and student body would do a fullthroated support and embrace of collegiate basketball culture and just be a basketball school. That's my opinion. Forget football.

I like this post, because I will admit I was at one point someone who would have done anything to have football. But as you described I love college basketball for all the reasons you mentioned. I actually can picture Mason making another deep run in the near future in March.

But I can't envision the same for football, it doesn't matter how bad I want/wanted it if its not a plan then it won't happen. So instead of focusing on what we don't have, I am excited for what we do have.

I just hate the constant debate though, because everyone points to why we can't have football. But honestly all those reasons are crap because if Mason wanted football we would overcome any obstacle. Mason simply just doesn't want football. And that's fine to not want it, but stop with the excuses.

 

[Walter]

JMU is playing for the FCS NC and I dare anyone to ask five friends if they knew that? For those of us not in Virginia, the response likely would be "JMU, who is that?"

 

[Herndon]

No... Herndon's just hopped up on cough syrup. He's normally a very reasonable pro-Mason b-ball poster. He'll look back on these posts and probably say, "Who the f*** posted that?!?!?!" Get better soon, H!

LOLOL.
1) this is, in fact, EXACTLY what was going on.
2) that said, if by some magical force, we could eliminate hoops, baseball, and soccer, and have sun belt football, i'd do it.
3) I am a reasonable person, and recognize that it's not NEARLY that simple, and it would take quite a bit more than just dropping those three sports, and FURTHER, I wouldn't want to drop those three sports. (actually, they could drop baseball and soccer, and I really wouldn't care )
4) I think it's healthy to continue to agitate for the big one (and lets not kid ourselves, football is the big one). Maybe it's not in the plans now, and maybe it won't be for a decade, but if we continue to express interest, maybe minds change, and maybe before I die, I can pay a ridiculous sum of money to see GMU play North Texas in the fatchicksgettingdoubleteamed.com bowl. A man can dream...
5) I really do love Mason hoops It's so much daggone fun.

 

[Vurbel]

I never


Just to play devils advocate; somehow umd, lsu, or any Florida school and California team are able to fill seats while still competing against professional teams and cities and nature.

And somehow a hippy state like Oregon is able to find fans.

My dad told me a saying when I was a kid and I think it applies perfectly to this situation. "He who says he can and he who says he can't are usually both right"

The person who thinks they can is more likely to succeed because they are willing to try, fail, and try again. The person who says they can't will not try, or at best they will try half heartedly.

Just food for thought

1. There is nothing else to do in College Park, especially compared to Fairfax, AND they get sorry attendance anyways, unless they're playing a marquee school like Michigan, Penn State, or Ohio State. None of which would be coming to Fairfax.

2. LSU is in Baton Rouge. Who is their closest competition? Saints? Texans?

3. Gainesville and Tallahassee are no metropolitan areas compared to DC. Miami is Miami in name only. They play in Miami Gardens, which is 25 minutes from Miami. Yes, there are things to do in Miami, but still not compared to DC.

4. The LA college football teams, especially USC, have a tradition. We'd be starting from scratch with zero tradition. Apples and oranges.

All of the above are BCS schools competing for a national title. At best we'd be competing in order to go out to North Dakota and play James Madison in a football tournament on ESPN6. Woopty-do.

 

[Falco]

1. There is nothing else to do in College Park, especially compared to Fairfax, AND they get sorry attendance anyways, unless they're playing a marquee school like Michigan, Penn State, or Ohio State. None of which would be coming to Fairfax.

2. LSU is in Baton Rouge. Who is their closest competition? Saints? Texans?

3. Gainesville and Tallahassee are no metropolitan areas compared to DC. Miami is Miami in name only. They play in Miami Gardens, which is 25 minutes from Miami. Yes, there are things to do in Miami, but still not compared to DC.

4. The LA college football teams, especially USC, have a tradition. We'd be starting from scratch with zero tradition. Apples and oranges.

All of the above are BCS schools competing for a national title. At best we'd be competing in order to go out to North Dakota and play James Madison in a football tournament on ESPN6. Woopty-do.

If you continue to read you will see my position on this.

But I will say it again. He who thinks he can, and he who thinks he can't are usually both right"

Yes finding a program would be difficult. But so is anything. It's difficult to have a reputable basketball program but should we stop trying all together. It was difficult to land a man on the moon. Good things are difficult. And if Mason plans and wants a football team they can make it happen.

But if Mason doesn't want a program and doesn't value football then that's fine. But I'm tired off all the reasons why we can't have football.

Personally I think the administration doesn't want football, but not because they can't have it. It's because they just don't want it.

 

[psyclone]

If you continue to read you will see my position on this.

But I will say it again. He who thinks he can, and he who thinks he can't are usually both right"

Yes finding a program would be difficult. But so is anything. It's difficult to have a reputable basketball program but should we stop trying all together. It was difficult to land a man on the moon. Good things are difficult. And if Mason plans and wants a football team they can make it happen.

But if Mason doesn't want a program and doesn't value football then that's fine. But I'm tired off all the reasons why we can't have football.

Personally I think the administration doesn't want football, but not because they can't have it. It's because they just don't want it.

It's a matter of funding and priorities. Football is extremely expensive and the return-on-investment at Mason's level is poor. Most football programs lose money. We have too many other "needs" central to the mission of the university to throw money at a "want".

 

[Bricker]

JMU is playing for the national championship as I type. Go to ESPN.com. Nothing. Click on NCAA football page. Nothing. Click scores. Nothing. Go to drop-down box. Cycle through every third rate BCS conference, then click on I-AA.

Aha! There's the box score!

No one knows this game is happening. No one cares outside of JMU/Youngstown St. fans. I was talking bowl game betting lines with some coworkers the other day and mentioned the game-- just to see if it was on anyone's radar. They all just chuckled.

I dug deeper. Could anyone name a team in CUSA? Nope (someone guessed Troy because they recently made a bet on them). Keep in mind, this is a group of pretty intense college sports fans.

I know football is fun. I like tailgating and going to games just as much as the next guy. But the reality is the barriers to entry in the college game are ridiculously high. Only the top 15-20 teams "matter" -- everyone else is begging for scraps. They are completely and totally irrelevant.

If Mason wants to seal its fate as an also-ran school with no aspirations aside from having a good time a couple of Saturdays in the fall, then let's dive headfirst into the college football fray.

I say we keep building our basketball identity and see where it takes us.

Sorry for beating a dead horse.

 

[Bricker]

JMU is playing for the national championship as I type. Go to ESPN.com. Nothing. Click on NCAA football page. Nothing. Click scores. Nothing. Go to drop-down box. Cycle through every third rate BCS conference, then click on I-AA.

Aha! There's the box score!

No one knows this game is happening. No one cares outside of JMU/Youngstown St. fans. I was talking bowl game betting lines with some coworkers the other day and mentioned the game-- just to see if it was on anyone's radar. They all just chuckled.

I dug deeper. Could anyone name a team in CUSA? Nope (someone guessed Troy because they recently made a bet on them). Keep in mind, this is a group of pretty intense college sports fans.

I know football is fun. I like tailgating and going to games just as much as the next guy. But the reality is the barriers to entry in the college game are ridiculously high. Only the top 15-20 teams "matter" -- everyone else is begging for scraps. They are completely and totally irrelevant.

If Mason wants to seal its fate as an also-ran school with no aspirations aside from having a good time a couple of Saturdays in the fall, then let's dive headfirst into the college football fray.

I say we keep building our basketball identity and see where it takes us.

Sorry for beating a dead horse.

A couple highlight clips are on the football page now (halftime). Point still stands.

 

[MasonFanatic]

If we want to build a solid football program that can last, then we need a solid foundation, and that means revamping the existing athletic department programs and facilities first. Once those needs are met, they we can build the next level, and the next. I don't think some posters here understand just how far behind some of our peers Mason is in facilities and fundraising. We have a lot of work to do, and whether we're going down the football path or focusing only on basketball, the near-term problems aren't much different. The best way to prove we can do football is to take care of the smaller stuff first.

Also, we would be wise to wait 5-10 years and see if non-Power 5 A-I football is still sustainable. There are signs of financial doom for a lot of those programs and conferences. Just because Charlotte and ODU have an FBS program now, doesn't mean they won't implode in the next decade and bankrupt their entire athletic departments.

 

[Bricker]

Also, we would be wise to wait 5-10 years and see if non-Power 5 A-I football is still sustainable. There are signs of financial doom for a lot of those programs and conferences. Just because Charlotte and ODU have an FBS program now, doesn't mean they won't implode in the next decade and bankrupt their entire athletic departments.

This x1,000. Excellent points.

 

[Vurbel]

If you continue to read you will see my position on this.

But I will say it again. He who thinks he can, and he who thinks he can't are usually both right"

Yes finding a program would be difficult. But so is anything. It's difficult to have a reputable basketball program but should we stop trying all together. It was difficult to land a man on the moon. Good things are difficult. And if Mason plans and wants a football team they can make it happen.

But if Mason doesn't want a program and doesn't value football then that's fine. But I'm tired off all the reasons why we can't have football.

Personally I think the administration doesn't want football, but not because they can't have it. It's because they just don't want it.

It's not that we *can't* have football. Sure, we can do it. But we would have to sacrifice too much for too little. Just because you can doesn't mean that you should.

 

[Walter]

It's not that we *can't* have football. Sure, we can do it. But we would have to sacrifice too much for too little. Just because you can doesn't mean that you should.

Exactly right. Opportunity cost. What would we give up to have football? A basketball practice, new arena, or the ability to pay our mbb coach the market rate next time we win a game in the NCAAs. Likely the cost would be all three.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

I would deem it highly likely Cabrera has a same-sex lover of some sort down Richmond way. Not saying this whole assignment is because of that, but probably played a part in his decision.

His flamboyant, exotic accent and impressive salary no doubt play very well down towards the city, Fan, and vcu-way.

Can we please stay on topic please.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

I'm not saying this is definitely the case, by the way. I'm just saying it definitely could be possible.

 

[Vurbel]

To put it in business language, there is little ROI compared to basketball/soccer/track. Best case scenario in football we upset James Madison in front of hundreds. Best case scenario in basketball is we upset Duke in front of millions. Realistic short term scenario in football is we are competitive in a sorry league. Realistic short term scenario in basketball is we are competitive in a top 5 basketball conference and get an upset or two each year against one of the "big boys."