Game 29: GMU (18-10 / 7-8) vs Duquesne (17-11 / 7-8) on Saturday, March 2, at 2:00 PM.

[Jack Strop]

The whole issue of not playing to protect one's "deal" from injury is dumb. Think about it... injuries to athletes occur at any time—games, conditioning, practice, and everyday life. One can't blanket oneself in bubble-wrap to preserve one's health. A serious athlete who wants to be a great player always plays, and plays to win, when the opportunity is available.

 

[GunstonsGhost]

I don't think I've seen it mentioned in this thread, so I'll add to the rumor mill. All the players signed autographs at the end of the game and Hall was the only one missing. He came out to the table at the very beginning signed one or two for what looked like someone he might have known and then bounced and didn't come back. He's the only player that wasn't there when we rolled through and we were in the middle of the line. Maybe Tony told him not to sign if he doesn't want to be part of the team?

I hope this is all over blown drama, but I've said a number of times throughout the season, Hall's frustrations with his teammates is written all over his body language. I would not be surprised to see him go, as unfortunate as that would be.

 

[gmuballer14]

No way to build a program if things like this could happen every year to the best players. Now it's like we have to prepare for Baraka to sit/leave next year after we have a 3 game losing streak smh.

 

[Jack Strop]

I hear you. At some point schools may band together (or conferences even) to protect themselves. Much like a coach has a buyout (or is required to give a home and home or a buyout in vcu's case), this protects the program in an age of jumping around happening so much. Let the next school have to pony up 10% more.

No idea how practical it is- but its definitely an interesting idea. I have to think the midmajor and low major programs have to do something to help themselves a little bit.

Something will shake out to protect the investments made by schools and it's fanbase. What the model looks like is TBD. Once it hurts enough teams, coaches, and fans then the needle will move. It may take some creativity, but market forces and competition will prevail.

 

[mkaufman1]

The whole issue of not playing to protect one's "deal" from injury is dumb. Think about it... injuries to athletes occur at any time—games, conditioning, practice, and everyday life. One can't blanket oneself in bubble-wrap to preserve one's health. A serious athlete who wants to be a great player always plays, and plays to win, when the opportunity is available.

I'm with you - thing is Hall is a serious athlete, but hes also serious about taking care of Keyshawn Hall at any means possible. To some degree, that should be the case for every athlete but this looks like its only about himself.

Its looking more and more like he could give two craps about who he plays for as long as it benefits himself at the end of the day. Its a shame he can't even honor and finish up the deal that Mason worked very hard to get for him. Its one thing to not be able to play, its another to not want to play.

His family is also most likely encouraging him to act like this as well, which is a shame as well. Disrespectful as well.

Something will shake out to protect the investments made by schools and it's fanbase. What the model looks like is TBD. Once it hurts enough teams, coaches, and fans then the needle will move. It may take some creativity, but market forces will prevail.

I hope so- and theres probably no perfect solution by any stretch. But at the very least there has to be something to help mitigate something.

Or nothing will happen and everything will just continue which would really suck.

 

[gmuballer14]

Something will shake out to protect the investments made by schools and it's fanbase. What the model looks like is TBD. Once it hurts enough teams, coaches, and fans then the needle will move. It may take some creativity, but market forces will prevail.

Yea it will be hard to continue supporting teams knowing that it will be stripped of its talent annually

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

I hope this is all over blown drama, but I've said a number of times throughout the season, Hall's frustrations with his teammates is written all over his body language. I would not be surprised to see him go, as unfortunate as that would be.

It is frustrating when you're the only one who doesn't know the score at the end of the game and all your teammates and everyone else in the building does, to be sure.

Listen, if he's too dumb the realize this will follow him around for the rest of his college career and impact his reputation in a negative way, then so be it.

But for all we know guy is in it 500k to the Vegas mob for fixing games or something. Sometimes people gotta grab that cash bag no matter what.

I'm just glad athletes like him are no longer exploited by the NCAA by only getting free college for playing basketball at least.

 

[Patriotsince81]

Apologies for the long essay. I know should have kept this to 140 characters so people would actually take the time to read it.

I'm old school. I believe you work hard to earn your spot in life.

I know NIL and the portal are here to stay. I'm not a fan of either and I know my opinion means nothing to those in power or kids today who have been told they are special since childhood. When it comes to NIL I'm of the belief that free room, board, free travel, books, tuition, adulation on campus, etc. was payment enough. I'd put that value at $200,000 or more. Starting a career without student loans is a pretty big deal and I've known many friends who took years to pay off loans. Athletes already had the advantage over regular students in pretty much every regard.

IMO Playing college basketball isn't a job and doesn't benefit society. Want to do something of value? Do something that provides goods, services, or benefits to others. Basketball provides a distraction during the cold winter months, that's it pretty much it. It's great game and a hell of a lot of fun to play, that's it.

I'm not in love with the idea of seeing our roster turn over by 50-75% every year. I have mad respect for players in the past who took pride in the name on the front of the jersey and cared little about the name on the back. Ike Tate remains a favorite of mine. He was a starter at DeMatha, came to Mason and sat on the bench for three years before getting a chance in his senior year to shine. He paid his dues, learned, and worked his a** off for his chance. All foreign concepts to most kids today.

IF what is rumored about Keyshawn is true I'd take away his scholarship now. If he wants to continue to attend Mason he can damn well pay for it like everyone else does. He can pay for a meal plan as well. IF rumors are true he should be banned from the bench, practices, gyms, etc. If he wants to work out he can go to the RAC like everyone else. Has he been given a car as part of his deal? If so, take back the keys. If he wants to buy it he's more than welcome to do so. It's time to stop treating college athletes like they're something special. There are consequences in life, both good and bad, for the choices we make. Many do not understand that.

Loyalty is paramount in my eyes as a quality that I respect and admire. Money, while essential, was never a motivating factor in my life/career decisions. I made enough to be comfortable. I know some will disagree with this but it is/was my choice.

I'm not on Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, Tik Tok, or the like. I have zero interest in "following" celebrities or anyone for that matter. I could give a crap what anyone has to say on social media. I have a mind of my own, why do I need to listen to a snot nosed 19 year share opinions about anything? You Tube videos that declare that a kid is the "Number One" ranked third grader in the nation is largely to blame for the sh&t show were are currently watching. Kids are taught by social media, parents, and those who follow them that they're somehow special because they can play a game. BFD.

I gave up on pro sports because of the absurd greed. The interesting thing is that I don't miss the NFL or NBA in the least. I found other things to do with my time. Is it time for me to give up on college basketball as well? I've been a Mason fan for 50 years. This is going to be a tough one. Does my love of the game of basketball and the fun I have with friends at games still outweigh the BS? Most likely.

Old man rant over, now get the Hell off my lawn!!!!!

 

[Jack Strop]

I have nothing but the utmost respect for the player who says, "Let's take care of the business aspect of the game in the off-season. Right now, I'm focused on my next game." If I were a teammate of the above player then it is he I want in my corner.

 

[GMU79]

The whole issue of not playing to protect one's "deal" from injury is dumb. Think about it... injuries to athletes occur at any time—games, conditioning, practice, and everyday life. One can't blanket oneself in bubble-wrap to preserve one's health. A serious athlete who wants to be a great player always plays, and plays to win, when the opportunity is available.

Ted Williams, .406.
Michael Jordan, the flu
Willis Reed
Ronnie Lott, cut off finger
etc.....

 

[FlPatriot]

The whole issue of not playing to protect one's "deal" from injury is dumb. Think about it... injuries to athletes occur at any time—games, conditioning, practice, and everyday life. One can't blanket oneself in bubble-wrap to preserve one's health. A serious athlete who wants to be a great player always plays, and plays to win, when the opportunity is available.

Think if one had a bag of money waiting for them AND their current team had little chance of progressing in the tournament the wise decision is take the money. I’d image the NIL deal has an out clause for injury…just like the pros.

 

[GMU79]

Apologies for the long essay. I know should have kept this to 140 characters so people would actually take the time to read it.

I'm old school. I believe you work hard to earn your spot in life.

I know NIL and the portal are here to stay. I'm not a fan of either and I know my opinion means nothing to those in power or kids today who have been told they are special since childhood. When it comes to NIL I'm of the belief that free room, board, free travel, books, tuition, adulation on campus, etc. was payment enough. I'd put that value at $200,000 or more. Starting a career without student loans is a pretty big deal and I've known many friends who took years to pay off loans. Athletes already had the advantage over regular students in pretty much every regard.

IMO Playing college basketball isn't a job and doesn't benefit society. Want to do something of value? Do something that provides goods, services, or benefits to others. Basketball provides a distraction during the cold winter months, that's it pretty much it. It's great game and a hell of a lot of fun to play, that's it.

I'm not in love with the idea of seeing our roster turn over by 50-75% every year. I have mad respect for players in the past who took pride in the name on the front of the jersey and cared little about the name on the back. Ike Tate remains a favorite of mine. He was a starter at DeMatha, came to Mason and sat on the bench for three years before getting a chance in his senior year to shine. He paid his dues, learned, and worked his a** off for his chance. All foreign concepts to most kids today.

IF what is rumored about Keyshawn is true I'd take away his scholarship now. If he wants to continue to attend Mason he can damn well pay for it like everyone else does. He can pay for a meal plan as well. IF rumors are true he should be banned from the bench, practices, gyms, etc. If he wants to work out he can go to the RAC like everyone else. Has he been given a car as part of his deal? If so, take back the keys. If he wants to buy it he's more than welcome to do so. It's time to stop treating college athletes like they're something special. There are consequences in life, both good and bad, for the choices we make. Many do not understand that.

Loyalty is paramount in my eyes as a quality that I respect and admire. Money, while essential, was never a motivating factor in my life/career decisions. I made enough to be comfortable. I know some will disagree with this but it is/was my choice.

I'm not on Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, Tik Tok, or the like. I have zero interest in "following" celebrities or anyone for that matter. I could give a crap what anyone has to say on social media. I have a mind of my own, why do I need to listen to a snot nosed 19 year share opinions about anything? You Tube videos that declare that a kid is the "Number One" ranked third grader in the nation is largely to blame for the sh&t show were are currently watching. Kids are taught by social media, parents, and those who follow them that they're somehow special because they can play a game. BFD.

I've gave up on pro sports because of the absurd greed. The interesting thing is that I don't miss the NFL or NBA in the least. I found other things to do with my time. Is it time for me to give up on college basketball as well? I've been a Mason fan for 50 years. This is going to be a tough one. Does my love of the game of basketball and the fun I have with friends at games still outweigh the BS? Most likely.

Old man rant over, now get the Hell off my lawn!!!!!

Brother, you nailed it. 50 years is right. Old gym on Ring (actually, half a ring) Rd. Myron Contee, Andre Gaddy, pull down risers, 10 fans, free entrance...and I had a blast!
I know I've complained about RP. Forget it. Let him stay. Finish his career. He has earned it.
And all the bleeding hearts on TV that say athletes bring in loads of revenue for the school and deserve a piece of the pie, they are getting it already. FREE tuition. FREE books. FREE food.
And yes, basketball, indeed all sports, are a fun distraction. Nothing more. I used to bleed sports. No more. NBA? Gone. NFL? Gone. NHL? Gone. MLB? Almost gone. NCAAF? Going. NCAAB? Gone, except for Mason (still TBD).
I'm in my 8th decade. I've got lots more life behind me than I do in front. I've got to seriously prioritize these days. And honestly, I haven't watched any of the last games live. If they win (Dayton) I watch on ESPN+, if they don't, I haven't wasted 2+ hours.
An old man rant? Maybe. And I don't care.
If these teams want me to watch, give me a reason.
EDIT: I should have also mentioned Malik. Stay and start him. He has earned it too.

 

[Verdad]

I suggested it previously, and the practicality of it would be TBD, but I think one possible answer is that the NIL payments are vested - meaning you get a certain percentage now (or throughout the year), but the full amount does not fully vest until you reach certain benchmarks - like finishing your career.

If you transfer, you don't get the remaining percentage - so we end up paying only for what we actually get (1 out of 3 years for example).

Obviously tons of variables and caveats that could be built in, and it would require other schools to do the same from a comparison standpoint.

 

[illayin]

Think if one had a bag of money waiting for them AND their current team had little chance of progressing in the tournament the wise decision is take the money. I’d image the NIL deal has an out clause for injury…just like the pros.

Agreed...this is just the reality of the situation unfortunately. The NIL rules have encouraged real money becoming a factor in decisions for 18-20 year olds who have never seen that type of money before and don't know that they will again. There are borderline G League two-way players and Euroleague (or lesser) guys getting significant bags to be role players at P5 schools. It's going to be impossible to compete without some changes.

So, it's surprising to me that so many are being so harsh toward KH and expecting him to not treat this like the business decision it's become. Don't get me wrong though, if he really has abandoned the team, I'll treat it like a business decision as well and boo the ever-living shit out of him if he ever plays at EBA again... so I definitely empathize with the sentiment.

 

[Patriot Lawdog]

Agreed...this is just the reality of the situation unfortunately. The NIL rules have encouraged real money becoming a factor in decisions for 18-20 year olds who have never seen that type of money before and don't know that they will again. There are borderline G League two-way players and Euroleague (or lesser) guys getting significant bags to be role players at P5 schools. It's going to be impossible to compete without some changes.

So, it's surprising to me that so many are being so harsh toward KH and expecting him to not treat this like the business decision it's become. Don't get me wrong though, if he really has abandoned the team, I'll treat it like a business decision as well and boo the ever-living shit out of him if he ever plays at EBA again... so I definitely empathize with the sentiment.

I guess my real problem is with it occurring during the season. If it happened after the season, I'd still be unhappy, but I'd put more blame on the system. I am somewhat optimistic that something will happen because of guys like Hunter Dickenson jumping ship at Michigan to go for a big payday at Kansas. It's one thing when Mason, Northern Colorado or Loyola get raided, people will look the other way. Quite another when teams like Michigan have it happen.

 

[gmubrian]

I hate to keep bringing it back to soccer, but they really do have a model for selling and buying teams to make developing players worth it…

But I say the only thing you can do is work with the other mid-major collectives to put a clause in any deal that if a player transfers to another program with a bigger NIL deal they have to kick back 10% to the collective. That way, any investment in a player that blows up gets recycled back to the next generation of players…if this happens repeatedly, your collective war chest might get quite large.

Start with the other A10 collectives and then work your way out from there—MVC, AAC, MAC, CAA, WCC, WAC, MWC, etc. The P4+1 want to come poaching? They’ll be donating to our collective to do it.

Thats an interesting point -but I'm not sure if that would even fly with potential recruits. Interested to hear @gmubrian have a take on this point.

The difficulty in this, ironically, comes from the few remaining NCAA related NIL rules:

"Two things remain disallowed by NCAA rules: 1) you can't pay a player, and, 2) no quid pro quo.

Players aren't supposed to get any compensation tied for performance, and recruits cannot sign any NIL deal contingent on going to any particular school."

From: NIL Article

So, NIL deals are limited in what restrictions/clauses they can use to that end.

This should also address any of the wild speculation about any already signed deals for a player to go to another school next year.

 

[gmujim92]

The difficulty in this, ironically, comes from the few remaining NCAA related NIL rules:

"Two things remain disallowed by NCAA rules: 1) you can't pay a player, and, 2) no quid pro quo.

Players aren't supposed to get any compensation tied for performance, and recruits cannot sign any NIL deal contingent on going to any particular school."

From: NIL Article

So, NIL deals are limited in what restrictions/clauses they can use to that end.

This should also address any of the wild speculation about any already signed deals for a player to go to another school next year.

I thought the pending lawsuit from Tennessee and Virginia opened the door for NIL inducements in recruiting … at least that is what has been reported.

 

[GMUgemini]

I thought the pending lawsuit from Tennessee and Virginia opened the door for NIL inducements in recruiting … at least that is what has been reported.

Yes. The NCAA announced a pause on all investigations dealing with NIL collective agreements. It’s essentially do what you want now.

 

[gmubrian]

I thought the pending lawsuit from Tennessee and Virginia opened the door for NIL inducements in recruiting … at least that is what has been reported.

Yes. The NCAA announced a pause on all investigations dealing with NIL collective agreements. It’s essentially do what you want now.

My understanding is that just prevented the NCAA from punishing schools for 3rd parties getting involved in the recruiting process. The two rules still are in place:

NIL Artilce

"...policies involving NIL compensation remain in place and will be enforced, including prohibitions on schools directly playing athletes and any payment or compensation being tied specifically to athletic performance"

While they can talk, theoretically, who would want to sign a deal ahead of time with a guy that is willing to stop playing just before the conference tournament if they can't force him to come to the school in the contract?

 

[Yossarian]

Umm… Hall is sick. My best friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s brother’s girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who’s going with a girl who saw Hall pass out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess it’s pretty serious.