Can mid-major programs make money?

GMUgemini

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Here's a couple of articles that argue that college athletic programs, especially at our level, do not make money:

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bas...any-ncaa-tournament-teams-did-not-turn-profit

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...0b1626-c8de-11e4-b2a1-bed1aaea2816_story.html

Food for thought.

I believe that it's entirely possible for a mid-major like Mason to make a "profit" on their basketball team, but I do not believe that when spread over an entire athletics department that a school without big time football can.
 

BandWagon18

Specialist
I looked at some financial docs from the AD and Mason men's basketball actually made a profit last year. But overall, the AD is running at a deficit.
 

Vurbel

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I believe that it's entirely possible for a mid-major like Mason to make a "profit" on their basketball team, but I do not believe that when spread over an entire athletics department that a school without big time football can.

I remember reading (somewhere) that most colleges with football actually lose money. That is the norm. Exceptions are Alabama, Penn St., Texas. I don't have a link for that, I just want to say that's what I've been taught in the past.
 

Dawgs99

Starter
I remember reading (somewhere) that most colleges with football actually lose money. That is the norm. Exceptions are Alabama, Penn St., Texas. I don't have a link for that, I just want to say that's what I've been taught in the past.


This is correct, 95% of BCS Football schools make money off their football program but actually run a deficet in the overall athletics budget. So many sports other than football/basektball are really a drain on the budget, its just the way it is. Even Texas with the Long Horn Network just barely makes a profit and they are one of the very few.
 

Five Two

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We must take these numbers in context. Many BCS schools report a loss or no profit. However, they do that in order to keep their 501(c)3 status. Many of the big name schools will spend $$ on stuff in order to make it look like they are not running a huge surplus.

This is not the case outside the power 5 conferences, though. I do believe those schools lose $$ on athletics because the TV $$ isn't there for them.
 

illayin

Sixth Man
A study by Robert Baker, the Director of the Sport Management Institute at George Mason, estimated that the University received over $677,000,000 worth of free publicity during the NCAA Tournament.

http://ahistoryofmason.gmu.edu/exhibits/show/presence/contents/the-season-of-a-lifetime--geor

And yes, I know... an average tournament run -- especially after Mason, Butler, and vcu have made the big runs a semi-regular thing -- are not going to be producing 677mil of free publicity. However, even a small percentage of that can make putting money into your athletic programs worth it. That is to say that you have to look past pure, tangible dollars and cents.
 
OP
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psyclone

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Speaking of money, here's a good article on how the NCAA tournament divides up the money :
http://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/sports/ncaa-money/

Interesting quotes on CAA:
But for smaller conferences, the basketball fund is much more important, in some cases constituting nearly 70 percent of annual revenue.

A handful of conferences are in a league of their own for overall revenue, thanks largely to television contracts related to football, dwarfing the rest of the conferences.


Large conferences get the bulk of the money, as they have more teams make the tournament and advance, but...


For smaller conferences, payments from the basketball fund represent a significant portion of revenue.

“The standard of living, if you will, is really dependant on the men’s basketball tournament,” said Tom Yeager, commissioner of the Colonial Athletic Association.

Yeager’s conference has its own complicated formula for the basketball fund: the conference keeps the money it is guaranteed every year thanks to its automatic bid, and any more money gets split in half, with one half getting split among the 10 schools, and the other half doled out competitively through an “Excellence Fund.”

In the 2006 tournament, Yeager’s conference enjoyed unexpected success that brought in larger-than-expected payments for years.

George Mason’s run to the Final Four, coupled with UNC- Wilmington making the tournament as an automatic bid, meant a six-unit tournament. That 2006 tournament earned an estimated $7.7 million over six years for a conference whose total annual revenue that year was $2.8 million. A lot of that money went into the “Excellence Fund” and found its way back to George Mason and other schools, and some of it stayed with the conference. Some it also went to cover conference costs, such as Yeager’s salary. Over the six years that 2006 tourney windfall paid out, Yeager saw his total compensation more than double, from $203,600 in 2006 to $428,130 in 2012, tax records show.

Yeager said there was no connection between tournament success and his pay. The CAA acquired football-playing schools in 2007, he said, and his responsibilities expanded.

“It didn’t have a darn thing to do with basketball,” Yeager said. “My compensation follows what’s going on in our schools and generally increases at a very modest rate.”
 

GMUgemini

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I wonder why they used 2006 and not 2011 when the CAA got three teams in, a run from the first four to the final four and a second team making the round of 32? That netted the CAA 9 units (if I'm calculating correctly), revenue the CAA is still collecting.
 

Five Two

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“The standard of living, if you will, is really dependant on the men’s basketball tournament,” said Tom Yeager, commissioner of the Colonial Athletic Association.
and yet his moves to make the CAA football conference all but killed CAA basketball
 

Walter

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Looks like we are going to need to raise more revenue or cut some programs.

http://hamptonroads.com/2015/03/mcauliffe-signs-bill-limits-athletic-student-fees


Division I schools that don't offer football can fund 78 percent of their budgets through student fees. Virginia Commonwealth (68 percent) is well under that limit, but George Mason (84 percent), Radford (88 percent) and Longwood (87 percent) may have to adjust.



The new law requires state agencies to come up with a standard formula for reporting athletic budgets by Nov. 1.

The law also requires state schools that want to add a major sport such as football, or seek to play at a higher NCAA level, receive approval from Intercollegiate Athletics Review Commission.

JMU has been contemplating a move into FBS. If the school decides to move up prior to July 1, 2016, it would not need approval from the commission. Any decision made after that date would need commission approval.
 
First thing to do is get rid of the people in the patriot club. Dont raise anything in arguably one of the riches areas in the country

Second, look at the sports not in the A-10, Wrestling and Men's Volleyball. Why have them if they dont compete in conference? Personally i really like both sports but you have to think about it.
 

GMUgemini

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First thing to do is get rid of the people in the patriot club. Dont raise anything in arguably one of the riches areas in the country

Second, look at the sports not in the A-10, Wrestling and Men's Volleyball. Why have them if they dont compete in conference? Personally i really like both sports but you have to think about it.

Wrestling is revenue neutral at this point. Cutting it won't help.
 

Pablo

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This might belong in a separate thread, but...

Last January, the NCAA passed saying colleges could give scholarship students the "full cost of attendance." Basically, scholarship money above and beyond the normal room and board. I see that Richmond and vcu are compensating their athletes $1300 and $4100 respectively. Are we? And if not, will we? And how much?

See http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-show-which-sports-colleges-want-to-spend-on/:

“'You’d like to do it across the board, but that’s a whole other conversation,' said Brad Edwards, athletics director at George Mason, where the 28 men’s and women’s basketball scholarship players will each get stipends of about $3,600, adding about $100,000 to the athletic department’s budget."
 

Vurbel

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See http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-show-which-sports-colleges-want-to-spend-on/:

“'You’d like to do it across the board, but that’s a whole other conversation,' said Brad Edwards, athletics director at George Mason, where the 28 men’s and women’s basketball scholarship players will each get stipends of about $3,600, adding about $100,000 to the athletic department’s budget."

Thank you. I was unaware of that. I wonder how $3600 stacks up against the rest of the A10.
 

GMUgemini

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Thank you. I was unaware of that. I wonder how $3600 stacks up against the rest of the A10.

I think we are one of the highest. The article Pablo posted (obviously this isn't all A-10 teams):

George Washington: $3,000
UVA: 3,180 for in-state athletes; $3,470-$4,450 to out-of-state
UMD: $3,200-$3,800
Georgetown $2,600 (cheapskates if you ask me)

We seem very competitive..
 
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